EDITOR’S NOTE: I’ve been sitting on this piece from THN Ombudsman Keith Silva for almost a month now, trying to figure out a way to respond that wasn’t simply defending against his points, but making points of my own.
I wanted to talk about how a rating like “skim it” has taken on a negative connotation when it shouldn’t, and how a phrase like “not for everyone” is just a simpler way of saying something to the effect of “look, I loved this thing, but you should know going in that it’s really weird/scary/gory/violent/surreal.” I wanted to talk about my own unabashed love for the superhero genre, and why those kinds of comics will always have a huge impact on THN, even as we strive to be diverse. There’s also the idea of explaining to guys like Frank Barbiere and Jim Zubkavitch that they’re part of the “1%” to contend with (see below).
I was going to try to work this into a longer “Nerd Fight” column, but after revisiting Keith’s essay, I’ve decided that there’s nothing to be gained from that because we’re BOTH right.
Last week, Image Comics Publisher Eric Stephenson addressed a group of comic retailers at a ComicsPRO event in Atlanta. During his speech, Stephenson spent several minutes shitting on everything from superhero comics to licensed properties to variant covers. He definitely made some strong points, but his decision to fire directly at the hard work of a lot of dedicated creators — whom many readers genuinely enjoy — has left both fans and his professional peers divided.
My reaction to Stephenson’s speech was this: Love the comics you want to love, and don’t let ANYONE — Stephenson, me and Matt, or Keith #$%@ing Silva — tell you that you’re wrong for doing so. And if you love something so much, that a “skim it” from me prompts you to respond with something like the piece you’re about to read, then the comics industry is lucky to have fans like you.
— Joe Patrick
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Callin’ Nerds on Their Nerd Stuff
By Keith Silva
Topic: “Not for Everyone”
It’s not on every podcast (Comics Therapy aside) where I hear an expletive added in between my first and last name. On THN #148 aka “Not for Everyone,” Joe Patrick threw a rod and in exasperation explained to his (always) clueless co-host why he kept repeating the phrase “not for everyone.” Joe said: ”This is from Keith [expletive deleted] Silva who just locks onto something we say and harps on it and harps on it!” Dude was pissed off.
Joe’s anger came from an honest place. Earlier in the week he had (very nicely) sent me a tweet to say THN was reviewing Mind MGMT, a book he knew I’ve championed. Since it was Twitter, I wrote a sarcastic response asking what the over/under would be on how many times he uses the phrase “not for everyone” in his discussion. My snark came from an honest place, too. For their “Take a Look It’s in a Book” segment on ep. #144, Joe and Matt reviewed Ryan Browne’s God Hates Astronauts. Although they both liked GHA, Joe gave it a “skim it” due to its overall weirdness. The phrase “not for everyone” was liberally applied by Mssr. Patrick.
GHA is great, and I’ve written about why I think it deserves more than a mere “skim it.” I took Joe’s comments to heart because I thought (at first) that he was being dismissive of a comic that’s mainstream enough for most readers, especially if superhero satire doesn’t give you the fantods. GHA is weird, sure, but there’s weirder out there … a lot weirder.
After a couple of emails back and forth, Joe and I retired to our respective corners agreeing that rating systems are flawed and reductive (Matt NEVER pays attention), and we, as critics, have to do our best to deal with these inherent flaws — all of them. Subtlety is tricky to achieve in short-form criticism (a first-world problem, for sure).
I thought Joe was “speaking as a retailer” and not as a well-informed critic with a podcast. I was wrong. Joe was speaking as Joe. I admire him for that. My guess is corporations like Marvel, DC (and Diamond?) are the rising tide that floats much of the retail market. So dissing mainstream comics wouldn’t be in young Joseph’s best interest or that of his darling wife or their dog. Bergen Street Comics can reduce how many Marvel and DC titles they choose to rack, but many retailers can’t (probably) be so brash or so choosy, and most comic book readers are creatures of habit. Know your audience. No judgment.
There are a lot of comics out there. Some of them are from Marvel and DC, others from Dark Horse, IDW and Image and others from places like Uncivilized Books, 2D Cloud or direct from the artists like those at Studio Lounak. Here’s where I’m coming from: Marvel and DC don’t need Matt, Joe or me to sell comics for them. They have TV shows, movies and 75 years of tradition. Pre-ordering your comics is smart and guarantees two things: you’ll get your comics (weather permitting) and companies will know what readers want, the ol’ vote with your wallet. While I’m throwing around clichés like truck tires, here’s another one: DC, Marvel, Dark Horse, Image and IDW are the 1%. There are thousands of comics out there NOT distributed by mainstream companies. So, what are we missing?
When we use phrases like “not for everyone” it’s a turn-off. If there’s one thing I’d be willing to guess about comic book readers, they don’t mind doing some research or picking something up especially if it’s from a trusted resource, even a friend. Small-press publishers and self-published comics won’t have the superheroes you’re used to, but so what? Some do feature superheroes, but there’s so much more. Some are gonzo, some are derivative, some are so cool they can’t be easily categorized and most are not “for everyone.” If you can imagine it, there’s somebody out there who’s making a comic about that very thing right now, and chances are good it ain’t comin’ from DC or Marvel or even Avatar. You have the great democratizing power of the Internet on your side, and failing that, you have your local Joe Patrick.
Comics are niche-y enough as it is. Let’s not continue to ghettoize this medium we love by talking (and writing) only about what we know everybody else is reading and talking about — so says the guy who wrote 800+ words on Ms. Marvel #1 this week. I want Joe and Matt to champion their favorites and talk about big releases because I (we) value their opinions. However, what I really want is to get turned on. Turn me on, nerds. Turn me on to a comic I missed or better yet, a comic I thought “wasn’t for me.”
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THN Ombudsman Keith Silva works in television. It’s a small space, but, hey, it’s show business! In his spare time, he writes for Comics Bulletin, Read Comic Books and his blog, Interested in Sophisticated Fun?.
Great post, Keith!
Part of the reason it’s hard for folks who might be interested in trying out new or different comics is that the small press was pushed out of Diamond when they raised their order minimums, making it nearly impossible to distribute their products to retail stores. The web has helped mitigate the distribution issue somewhat, but it can still be hard to find what’s out there. Readers can’t just pick up a small press book to see if it’s for them very easily anymore
However, there are sites that help curate and review smaller books for interested readers, like The Comics Journal, The Comics Reporter, The Beat (which also does a good job covering mainstream work), and Rob Clough’s High-Low review site, to name just a few. The Tiny Report is a new blog that is exclusively covering micro-press publishers.
All of this is to say: there’s other stuff out there, it’s just not as easy for people to find as say, picking something off the rack. This goes double for reviewers since they are likely to have a day job already. It’s easier to grab something off the rack if you are already grabbing your weekly comics at the store. It doesn’t make them lazy or anything like that.
It does, however, make for a lot of the existing coverage seem virtually interchangeable. I wish there were more outlets that covered the entirety of comics versus the 1% like you mentioned (especially being a small press cartoonist like myself). I think there’s an amazing comic for everyone out there and they might not even know it. For now, they just have to work a little harder to find it.
Max,
Thanks for your insightful comment. I agree with *everything* you’ve said here. I’ve never thought about the ‘interchangeableness’ of most comics writing. You’re right, of course and we all can and should do better to push ourselves and our readers to look at more than just what’s at hand. Also, thanks for opening my eyes to a policy at Diamond that runs in the face getting more small press books into reader’s hands.
If you’re looking for more websites that promote small press, DIY and digital only comics, please check out my colleagues at http://comicsbulletin.com/. Most (almost all) of what I write focuses on small press and independent publishers.
Thanks again for your comment and please let me know where I can find more of your work. If you use Twitter, you can reach me at @keithpmsilva.
As someone who has the wonderful joy of running writing by Keith Silva and a slew of other writers who celebrate all the comics they love – indie comics, mainstream comics, digital comics, abstract comics, historical comics, cutting edge comics and conservative comics – I have to agree with Keith.
I appreciate where Keith is coming from because this past week I had a series of experiences that underlined how unique my approach is to comics and where my specific love for certain content is coming from.
On Sunday I pulled out volume 4 of the Steve Ditko Archives and was so blown away by the quality and professionalism of the work that Ditko did on those comics that I literally couldn’t sleep. I kept thinking about how beautiful his storytelling was and how he elevated crappy stories to fine art. Is that “not for everyone”? How could such beautiful work be “not for everyone”? Why isn’t everybody talking about this?
Wednesday I went to my LCS and bought a stack of comics. As usual, some were good and some were bad according to my tastes. One stood out for me – Fantastic Four #1. To me the comic was mediocre, with interesting elements but some flaws in art and story, especially in the Fing Fang Foom sequence. I disliked it but many of my friends loved the book. Again, does that mean that THIS comic was “not for everyone”? It probably sold a kajillion copies, though, which means it didn’t matter what a critic said, the book was serving its purpose.
Next I read a stack of small press and self-published comics by Box Brown, Joseph Remnant and others. Each one in their own way blew me away, made me excited for the comics form, thrilled me deeply as a reader. But these books get almost no pub (we cover them on Comics Bulletin, FWIW) and could benefit from media coverage. They’re diverse, smart, cutting edge comics that do interesting things with time, character and scene-setting. Again, are they “not for everyone”? Like the Ditko books, they’re brilliant but no-one is talking about them. They’re lost in a pool of other great material.
I’m not sure what my point is here beyond saying that almost any comic can be both “not for everyone” and “the greatest goddamn thing you’ve ever read.” I get that THN is intended mainly for mainstream fans, and I listen and call in my AOTW every week so I’m not going to tune away. But I’d love if you guys could cover more material, unapologetically and happily, even if it’s a segment where fans don’t just talk about their love for Atari Force but also for Box Brown.
I dunno, I’m talking out of my ass here a little bit, or maybe just talking about *my* approach for *my* site, but honestly talking about the small press stuff is much more enjoyable than being the 34th site to post a review of the rebooted Fantastic Four.
Thanks for sharing your site, Keith and Jason! I’ll add it to my RSS. Couldn’t agree more with what Box Brown is doing with Retrofit. I was a big fan of Oily Comics too until the subscription model ended. REAL RAP was one of my favorite comics last year and I think only a couple sites mentioned it, that I know of at least.
Obviously, I love Two-Headed Nerd a great deal, and it’s my favorite way to keep up with what is going on in the mainstream. I’ve known these two screwballs for a long time now, and love their opinions on comics. I think that’s also the flip side to this conversation: I’d hate to have someone think they have to cover all the other work out there, especially if it doesn’t interest them. I definitely engage more with the ones that do, but that’s because it’s more inline with my tastes.
I read this this morning then I went on a twitter rant. It wasn’t a rant against the article or the message (the message I got from it) it was more along the lines of new comic book readers and how they actually get into comics.
To sum the rant up, whatever gets them into the hobby, great, cherish that and admire that even if they are picking up Spider-Man or My Little Pony.
Depending on their initial experience they may expand into other comics, genres, etc. As a long time comic fan I wouldn’t push my advice onto them, if asked I might recommend what they may like to read based on how well I knew them.
I have a friend who is meh about superheroes, so when we went to the comic shop I recommended Manhattan Projects – it just suit him.
I like the idea of independent books being talked about, you hear a passion that goes beyond any typical comic book review – it’s why I want to pick up D4VE. If I read a typical review of D4VE …well I wouldn’t have. I listen to a number of comic book podcasts but avoid any that attempt or describe it having reviews. So when I listened to burnt weiners describe D4VE with such a passion that the story, concept and whatnot …I had to get it!
This is kind of rambly, I do that, I cannot write, I tried reviewing comics and realized I suck at it. I also realized that hasn’t stop many websites. I o think they review a book like FF#1 cause it’ll get hits while small time press books won’t (or wouldn’t as much). Maybe I’m off base but it seems to be the case.
Where was I? Oh yeah, so should a person get into comics, let them feel around, they’ll discover things like this podcast or others and yes, talk about FF, and Image, and IDW, and small time, truly indie books! As long as you’re reading them and enjoying them. That’s my point of all this.
If you talk about a book, regardless of the publisher, or lack of one, and you really love the book, that will come across to a listener, brand new or otherwise.